How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,? - Page 3 - MensTennisForums.com
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post #31 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:38 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

Interesting question although agree and disagree with some points.

In the case of Great Britain there has been no Grand Slam or Davis Cup victories in the Open era and it is surprising there has been such a shortage. Agree with your point fully.

Australia has had a similar record to France in the last 30 years since 1981. Australia have won 4 Davis Cup while France have won 3 Davis Cup and Australia have seen players win 5 GS while France has only won 1 GS. France do not seem more successful than Australia.

Spain have been far more successful winning 4 Davis Cup in 10 years and mostly likely number 5 this year and seen players win 15 Grand Slams in the last 20 years. So certainly agree although I do not seen any players of potential Grand Slam winning quality coming through in the next generation (not seen Spanish players in discussions of future top players).

The current greatness league of active players in order of achievements to date (a factual comparison rather than fan biased assessment):

Federer 19 GS, 6 Year End Masters, 26 Master Series.
Nadal 15 GS, 30 Master Series, 1 Olympic Gold.
Djokovic 12 GS, 5 Year End Masters, 30 Master Series.



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post #32 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:40 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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Originally Posted by Aphex View Post
Swedish tennis is dying because the federation has been run by morons since the mid 90s especially when it comes to player developement programs. Sweden should honestly always have 2-3 players in every 100-segment of the rankings based on tradition alone. That small country argument is such a lame excuse for failure to uphold a winning educational culture.
Kent Carlsson summed it up after he retired. They used to lead the way with organisation, then got lazy and everyone else passed them.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

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Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #33 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:42 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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We have Murray, and he's far better than any French player.

Nowadays, Murray >>>>> France/USA/Australia's players combined.
At times I do feel your rating of Murray is in excess of the factual reality.

The current greatness league of active players in order of achievements to date (a factual comparison rather than fan biased assessment):

Federer 19 GS, 6 Year End Masters, 26 Master Series.
Nadal 15 GS, 30 Master Series, 1 Olympic Gold.
Djokovic 12 GS, 5 Year End Masters, 30 Master Series.


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post #34 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:43 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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Originally Posted by Aphex View Post
Swedish tennis is dying because the federation has been run by morons since the mid 90s especially when it comes to player developement programs. Sweden should honestly always have 2-3 players in every 100-segment of the rankings based on tradition alone. That small country argument is such a lame excuse for failure to uphold a winning educational culture.
i agree...

player development is about investment yes... but, it is a MASSIVE secondary to leadership and the systems they employ...

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why are you so seriously
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post #35 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:44 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

I bet GB spends more money to find new talents than the other 3 together. Maybe they just don't have talented youngsters.
Liam Broady is very talented IMO, but his career management looks like shit so far and his father fucked up his FO.
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post #36 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:45 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

One solution for Great Britain, Australia and Sweden could be put their players to play in Spain.
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post #37 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:47 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

fast_clay loves this carrot metaphor

Rafael Nadal & Novak Djokovic: The Evoulution of a Handshake
federer ferrer wawrinka raonic flopez istomin mannarino pospisil
verdasco

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post #38 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:47 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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One solution for Great Britain, Australia and Sweden could be put their players to play in Spain.
Spain has AMAZING tennis facility for years, florida in america is another good place to train, florida is tennis' haven their alot of players in america and around the world, either go to spain or go to florida, look for example, rafa invited murray to train in spain when murray was 15 and murray absolutely loved it their
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post #39 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:50 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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Spain has AMAZING tennis facility for years, florida in america is another good place to train, florida is tennis' haven their alot of players in america and around the world, either go to spain or go to florida, look for example, rafa invited murray to train in spain when murray was 15 and murray absolutely loved it their
I agree!
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post #40 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:51 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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One solution for Great Britain, Australia and Sweden could be put their players to play in Spain.
It worked for Murray although it took until this year before Murray was taken seriously on a clay court.

The current greatness league of active players in order of achievements to date (a factual comparison rather than fan biased assessment):

Federer 19 GS, 6 Year End Masters, 26 Master Series.
Nadal 15 GS, 30 Master Series, 1 Olympic Gold.
Djokovic 12 GS, 5 Year End Masters, 30 Master Series.


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post #41 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:59 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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Originally Posted by NadalMyHero View Post
he for some reason struggles on clay sometimes i dunno why, he loved clay, he trains their before alot of times, but for some reason he jus doesnt get clay that much at all, i thought he'll be better that djokovic tbh, but i forgot that nole did train on clay in serbia too, but still it doesnt make sense that hes not doing well on clay
This is not a Murray on clay thread, it's actually getting away from the topic of this thread which is overall player development why the UK and Australia aren't producing and not specific players.

It's very easy as to why Murray doesn't do as well, try the forehand and that's it.

Different economic conditions help as well as the cyclical nature of sport.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #42 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 08:59 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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fast_clay loves this carrot metaphor
heh heh... it's true though... ever read freakanomics...?

the western world runs almost entirely upon incentive...

so then, where do you place the largest volume of incentive...?

it is very simple...

so, when everybody is on the same page and all have transparency from top to bottom, then even the local coach with a few good juniors will buy into it... they will go to work on developing a kid's serve much quicker with clearer direction for that player 8 years down the road knowing that the kid is not gonna be a junior forever - a scene where only senior achievement is rewarded...

get every single person buying into a path leading in the same direction and boom - you have a culture delivering many different ways to get the job done at senior level...

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why are you so seriously
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post #43 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 09:12 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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Originally Posted by fast_clay View Post
heh heh... it's true though... ever read freakanomics...?

the western world runs almost entirely upon incentive...

so then, where do you place the largest volume of incentive...?

it is very simple...

so, when everybody is on the same page and all have transparency from top to bottom, then even the local coach with a few good juniors will buy into it... they will go to work on developing a kid's serve much quicker with clearer direction for that player 8 years down the road knowing that the kid is not gonna be a junior forever - a scene where only senior achievement is rewarded...

get every single person buying into a path leading in the same direction and boom - you have a culture delivering many different ways to get the job done at senior level...
The fact when you see a player who is your peer doing well that forces others to work harder creating competition to raise their level. It's a long term project, but the instant gratification always want results straight away, doesn't work.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #44 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 09:12 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

What exactly was America doing so well before that it isn't doing now? Isn't this more tied to tennis popularity and chance than anything? Why did we have two all time greats a the same time and along with a couple of grandslam winners? Shouldn't all those young boys be playing tennis watching then be playing at the top now? What about the Williams- we've had again, two phenomenal Grand Slam champs at the same times on the women's side, but no one on the horizon.

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post #45 of 82 (permalink) Old 10-22-2011, 09:22 PM
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Re: How come Great Britain and Australia can't produce players like France, Spain,?

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What exactly was America doing so well before that it isn't doing now? Isn't this more tied to tennis popularity and chance than anything? Why did we have two all time greats a the same time and along with a couple of grandslam winners? Shouldn't all those young boys be playing tennis watching then be playing at the top now? What about the Williams- we've had again, two phenomenal Grand Slam champs at the same times on the women's side, but no one on the horizon.
i have to agree with this, its so sad that you have great young talents on the mens side like isner, querey, young, harrison, that guy who played well against nadal um that 22 yr old white guy(i forgot his name ) and then on the women side we have mcchale, glatch, king, stephens, vandeweghe, falconi and oudin but yet i think either their coaching staff is not doing well or their managment is jus plain stupid, for one thing if your gonna bring up talents, why dont you train them in another country instead of jus playing in america and jus training in america

the tennis association on the american side is jus right now its not even funny
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