The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP level. - Page 9 - MensTennisForums.com
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post #121 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 03:06 AM Thread Starter
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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Classic example of the above Filo statement is when Lorenzi beat Paire in Vienna.
That's the match I had in mind when making that comment
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post #122 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 03:14 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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No, it isn't. Lorenzi gets exposed in ATP tournaments but he beats anyone who isn't consistent. Guys with his play style can make a career because he fights and won't beat himself. He makes his opponents beat him. Guys out of the top 50 generally aren't good enough to consistently be offensive without making errors unless they're at the top of their game.
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There needs to be more money in challengers and more points in ATP Q matches, and ATP R1 slams. And maybe select 10-12 big challengers per season that reward 120 points, and the rest keep at 60. Because the same problems that were happening when I made this thread are still happening. Some of those Asian challengers reward 125 points yet have cutoffs in the 300s.
It's hard to make a living off of an 8-17 record at the ATP level though! I appreciate the way he plays, but he doesn't have the weapons to be consistent at that level.

That sounds fairly good I see a few Challengers with fields way better than the majority of 250's which really shouldn't happen imho...

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post #123 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 03:30 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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It's hard to make a living off of an 8-17 record at the ATP level though! I appreciate the way he plays, but he doesn't have the weapons to be consistent at that level.

That sounds fairly good I see a few Challengers with fields way better than the majority of 250's which really shouldn't happen imho...
I don't think so, name one.

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post #124 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 03:37 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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I don't think so, name one.
This one wasn't half bad: http://www.atpworldtour.com/Share/Ev...?e=2273&y=2012

But now looking at ATP draws, I take that back

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post #125 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:12 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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This one wasn't half bad: http://www.atpworldtour.com/Share/Ev...?e=2273&y=2012

But now looking at ATP draws, I take that back
I know that sometimes the CH draws in the 2nd week of majors and a couple others can be quite good, but I'm sure they still aren't better than the worst 250, cause players in the top 50 at the time can't enter them unless they get a WC, this is probably the best one Dallas 2: http://www.atpworldtour.com/posting/2012/6486/mds.pdf

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Last edited by Transcender; 11-05-2012 at 04:21 AM.
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post #126 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:16 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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I know that sometimes the CH draws in the 2nd week of majors can be quite good, but I'm pretty sure they still aren't better than the worst 250.
Well they might actually challenge a tournament like this:
http://www.atpworldtour.com/Share/Ev...Id=568&Draw=ms

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Number of Times I've Cried Over Sucking at FITD: All but seven

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post #127 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:19 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

Bratislava is still better than some of the lower level ATP events.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

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I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #128 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:35 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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Bratislava is still better than some of the lower level ATP events.
It's not even one of the very best CH's.

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post #129 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:41 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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It's not even one of the very best CH's.
That shows the level of some of the IS events doesn't it? Not all the 125k events this season were good. Marbella 30K is better than Chennai.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

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Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #130 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:47 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
There needs to be more money in challengers and more points in ATP Q matches, and ATP R1 slams. And maybe select 10-12 big challengers per season that reward 120 points, and the rest keep at 60. Because the same problems that were happening when I made this thread are still happening. Some of those Asian challengers reward 125 points yet have cutoffs in the 300s.
Thing with the above while it's all true. The ATP have shown they don't care too much when it comes to this level and won't do anything about it.

The 70-120 spots, there is very little difference between these guys, but they have to live and play a mix between Challengers and ATP events. Klizan, Dog Balls did it to get their ranking up but were able to stay there. The guys like Junqueira, Prodon just aren't good enough.

Bedene will be a good test next season, then you have Kavcic who wins matches on the main tour though normally loses at QF level there, which is about his realistic level when he does well at the moment.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #131 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 04:47 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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That shows the level of some of the IS events doesn't it? Not all the 125k events this season were good. Marbella 30K is better than Chennai.

What I'm saying is that Bratis isn't really close to trying to compete with the worst 250's, St. Petersburg for example is still better than it.

That's a joke right, cause it's clearly not even close.

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post #132 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 05:40 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

With Newport actually looking alright and Joberg dumped I can't think of an ATP event that was worse than a Challenger, except Dallas-2.

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post #133 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 05:46 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

Anyhow, I think that Kamke is a player who is probably too good for CH's, yet won't ever make it full time on tour.

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post #134 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 06:39 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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With Newport actually looking alright and Joberg dumped I can't think of an ATP event that was worse than a Challenger, except Dallas-2.
Newport will go back to its usual level next year. St.Petersburg was pretty poor even if guys I like did well.

On Nadal bumping him on the changeover, Rosol said: "It's ok, he wanted to take my concentration; I knew he would try something".


Wilander on Dimitrov - "He has mind set on imitating Federer and yes it looks good. But he has no idea what to do on the court".

Quote:
Originally Posted by Filo V. View Post
I definitely would have preferred Gaba winning as he needs the points much more, but Jan would have beaten him anyway. I expect Hajek to destroy Machado, like 6-1 6-2.
Machado wins 6-2 6-1
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post #135 of 176 (permalink) Old 11-05-2012, 06:56 AM
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Re: The dilemma of being too good for challengers and not good enough at the ATP leve

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Newport will go back to its usual level next year. St.Petersburg was pretty poor even if guys I like did well.
Yeah true that.

Would still take St Petersburg over most Challengers even if it was pretty ordinary.

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