Raonic's baseline game > Karlovic's, Isner's; = Roddick's - MensTennisForums.com

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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 06:44 PM Thread Starter
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Raonic's baseline game > Karlovic's, Isner's; = Roddick's

>Karlovic?
=Karlovic?
<Karlovic?
>Isner?
=Isner?
<Isner?

I don't like the tag of all-serve mug on Milos. Somehow doesn't suit him at all! Discuss.

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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 06:46 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

miles better than isner and karlovic combined but still needs time to mature.
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 06:49 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

i just took a look at him for the very first time. his greatest asset is his testicular fortitude. he is just not scared of anyone and he hangs tough in important moments.

his serve is amazing and it is going to get better once he learns to move it well around the box.

his movement is not good enough for clay and its really not good enough for hard courts either. top guns will eat his lunch and i am talking about guys like fed, nadal, djokovic, and murray.

and finally the ground game is weak. backhand is excellent but the forehand is quite inconsistent.

solution: there are no solutions to the lack of optimal movement. you can keep working and maybe learn to anticipate better but with great movement, either you have it or you dont.

he can develop a little more consistency but he will have to log in long hours on clay and also play several small clay events a year.

he is has the potential to be top 20.
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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 06:51 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

>Karlovic for sure

comparing to Isner I would also say superior after watching several matches, esp against Ferrer and Fish.

Anyway, he has a strange baseline game comparing to modern game : often goes for the winner, and for sure it makes people surprised because it's not today's game, even Söderling doesn't go as much for the winner, usually mostly keeps controlling the rally, Isner the same, only sometimes big forehand but not as often

That surely reminds me of the 90s and not today's game.

Well I don't expect anything too high from him as some do : maximum top-10 but not top-5 (by the way even Isner may reach top-10 one day, it's possible imo, even Massu did it ).

But I'm surprised when I read people say "he has no baseline game" : I saw him against Ferrer and that's quite a big test !

He also broke Fish twice in that final set with some good rallies

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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:17 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clay Death View Post
i just took a look at him for the very first time. his greatest asset is his testicular fortitude. he is just not scared of anyone and he hangs tough in important moments.
Agreed, General CD! He's got a Nadal-like head in a tall body. Rare in a 20 year old. He had 4 tight 3 set matches and won them all after winning the previous tournament. Tons of steel up there + booming serve!

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his movement is not good enough for clay and its really not good enough for hard courts either. top guns will eat his lunch and i am talking about guys like fed, nadal, djokovic, and murray.
Agreed. The top players might expose his weak baseline game but considering other booming servers, I think his game is more well-grounded. Clearly, he's not got so far only on merit of his serves alone.

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and finally the ground game is weak. backhand is excellent but the forehand is quite inconsistent.
Inconsistent but very powerful when it works.

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solution: there are no solutions to the lack of optimal movement. you can keep working and maybe learn to anticipate better but with great movement, either you have it or you dont.

he can develop a little more consistency but he will have to log in long hours on clay and also play several small clay events a year.

he is has the potential to be top 20.
Well, he's going to Acapulco next week.

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>Karlovic for sure

comparing to Isner I would also say superior after watching several matches, esp against Ferrer and Fish.
I think he's >Karlovic and Isner. He broke Fish and Kendrick without tie-breaks. That says plenty about his baseline game.

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Anyway, he has a strange baseline game comparing to modern game : often goes for the winner, and for sure it makes people surprised because it's not today's game, even Söderling doesn't go as much for the winner, usually mostly keeps controlling the rally, Isner the same, only sometimes big forehand but not as often

That surely reminds me of the 90s and not today's game.
That's mostly adrenaline, I'm sure.

Quote:
Well I don't expect anything too high from him as some do : maximum top-10 but not top-5 (by the way even Isner may reach top-10 one day, it's possible imo, even Massu did it ).

But I'm surprised when I read people say "he has no baseline game" : I saw him against Ferrer and that's quite a big test !

He also broke Fish twice in that final set with some good rallies
He's beaten 4 top ten opponents now: Fish, Tabasco, Fiasco, and Youzhny.

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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:24 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

His forehand is huge. Anyone not moonballing every second point is going to make mistakes from time to time.

His backhand sucks. It bounces short 80% of the time. His slice also floats a lot.

At least he's not afraid of going forward. His movement is a bit deficient but he'll surely improve with age. He's just starting his career.
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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:24 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

i think it's worth noting his tactical awareness and willingness to extend a rally and use the pressure he has built against his opponent instead of opting to ball bash...

that game to break fish at 2-2 in the third... raonic up 0-30 returning, very aware, fish gets raonic on the run... raonic plugs back slice forehand after slice forehand when he could well have loaded up his forehand drive - but no, in the heat of battle just knows that fish is not gonna do too much with deep non pace junk he's feeding... waits... and a much better opportunity to load up on a forehand presents itself...

0-40

for me, just more tactically aware from the back i think (than isner n karlovic)... and doesnt at all mind junking it to allow his opponent to feel the pressure he's applied inside an extended rally instead of being rash himself...

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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:29 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

Well, Galo Blanco is his coach. Rally-wise he is in good hands and he will develop.

I don't really like the Karlovic or Isner comparisons; Karlovic is a joke, he already is in defense if the rally lasts for more than 4 shots. Isner has developed here though but tends to push.

Milos rather reminds me of Roddick from before his pushing era (from several years ago - yes). Also similar mental attitude and can really hit a juicy winner. Plus has to work on bh.

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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:29 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

Quote:
Originally Posted by fast_clay View Post
i think it's worth noting his tactical awareness and willingness to extend a rally and use the pressure he has built against his opponent instead of opting to ball bash...

that game to break fish at 2-2 in the third... raonic up 0-30 returning, very aware, fish gets raonic on the run... raonic plugs back slice forehand after slice forehand when he could well have loaded up his forehand drive - but no, in the heat of battle just knows that fish is not gonna do too much with deep non pace junk he's feeding... waits... and a much better opportunity to load up on a forehand presents itself...

0-40

for me, just more tactically aware from the back i think (than isner n karlovic)... and doesnt at all mind junking it to allow his opponent to feel the pressure he's applied inside an extended rally instead of being rash himself...
I think the point to get to match point was like this as well. He kept rallying when he had plenty of chances to ballbash and finally Fish send a backhand to the net.
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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:35 PM
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post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:36 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

He's better than Karlovic for sure. Ivo's old... not going to make any huge improvements in the time he has left. Isner is not too old, but lacks passion and isn't strong enough mentally; he has time to improve, but I don't think he will make any major strides. I'd say Milos is already better, but also has the potential to grow a lot.

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post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:37 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nathaliia View Post
Well, Galo Blanco is his coach. Rally-wise he is in good hands and he will develop.

I don't really like the Karlovic or Isner comparisons; Karlovic is a joke, he already is in defense if the rally lasts for more than 4 shots. Isner has developed here though but tends to push.

Milos rather reminds me of Roddick from before his pushing era (from several years ago - yes). Also similar mental attitude and can really hit a juicy winner. Plus has to work on bh.
Cetainly the best comparison of Raonic although the Roddick serve and forehand had more penetration and were more consistent in his top 3 period.
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post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:39 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

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Originally Posted by GlennMirnyi View Post
His forehand is huge. Anyone not moonballing every second point is going to make mistakes from time to time.

His backhand sucks. It bounces short 80% of the time. His slice also floats a lot.

At least he's not afraid of going forward. His movement is a bit deficient but he'll surely improve with age. He's just starting his career.
I think comparisons with Soda would be more appropriate for his baseline game. He likes to attack, take the risks and often pays for it. Still goes on. Yes, that forehand can generate Delpo like power, though he tends to lean a bit more to do so.

I think this kid can give Nadal trouble!

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post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:42 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

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Originally Posted by DrJules View Post
Cetainly the best comparison of Raonic although the Roddick serve and forehand had more penetration and were more consistent in his top 3 period.
Yeah Milos isn't top 3 yet; I thought of Roddick who showed up at the US tournaments once and stormed through them beating Rios and some other good players out of nowhere

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post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 02-19-2011, 07:45 PM
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Re: Raonic's baseline game is...

Isner not strong enough mentally? If anything that's what makes him a top 20-30 player. He always comes through in those tight tiebreak moments. That's also why he won the Mahut match. Otherwise, his ground game sucks all around except for when he goes for a forehand. He just pushes the ball around and a lot of times he floats a slice long or can't even get to the ball. Not to mention he has awful volleys.

Milos has a great baseline game. It's never going to be a GOAT baseline game but it really doesn't have to be with his serve and powerful groundstrokes. I love Andy Roddick, but once the ball is in ball all he does is push and slice the ball around. Milos at least has a well rounded game and really no true liability or holes in his game that can really hurt him.
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