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post #1 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:45 PM Thread Starter
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Nadal May Be Vulnerable

I told you so. Didn't I tell you so? Simon Reed attacks again:
http://eurosport.yahoo.com/19052009/...ulnerable.html

How's Djokovic a threat to Nadal when he hasn't beaten Nadal in all his tries on clay. Has Novak really beat Rafa in a best of 5 sets match? No! I am not saying Roger or Andy can beat Rafa but why is Djokovic a big threat? I just can't see him beating Nadal in RG for 3 sets. Sorry Reed! And didn't you say Verdasco was better than Novak just a couple of weeks ago?

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post #2 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:47 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

Ridiculous from Reed to be even mentioning Nadal as a possible RG champ after what we saw at the weekend. Can't see past Fed for the title.
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post #3 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:50 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Ridiculous from Reed to be even mentioning Nadal as a possible RG champ after what we saw at the weekend. Can't see past Fed for the title.
Djokovic has a chance if he plays his best ever tennis...ever.

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post #4 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:50 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

Nadal will take RG again, the Madrid final win serves Fed for the rest of the season, and could encourage players to play more seriously against Nadal than if he won Madrid.

as for Reed jumping over the bandwagon, NID.

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post #5 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:52 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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A lot of people within the world of tennis are already saying that Roger Federer's win over Rafael Nadal in the final of the Madrid Masters is an insignificant blip on Nadal's dominance of the game.

I'm not so sure. There are two things which will determine how much it could means: first, how much Federer believes in his victory; and second, and how much Nadal believes in his defeat.
Reed, that was the fourth strike buddy!

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post #6 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:56 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Originally Posted by cyrusking View Post
I told you so. Didn't I tell you so? Simon Reed attacks again:
http://eurosport.yahoo.com/19052009/...ulnerable.html

How's Djokovic a threat to Nadal when he hasn't beaten Nadal in all his tries on clay. Has Novak really beat Rafa in a best of 5 sets match? No! I am not saying Roger or Andy can beat Rafa but why is Djokovic a big threat? I just can't see him beating Nadal in RG for 3 sets.
Agree with the last bit...I don't see Djokovic, or anyone for that matter, beating a FIT Nadal over a 5-set clay court match. However, it is unfair to judge Djokovic entirely on the fact that he has yet to beat Nadal on clay...I mean, you could argue that Fed got lucky in both of his clay wins over Rafa. The Hamburg '07 was at the end of a 2-week stint for Rafa, and he'd survived a close shave against Hewitt in the Saturday SF. The Madrid 2009 final...well, nothing more needs to be said about that Saturday SF against Djokovic.

In essence, I agree with Reed thinking that Djokovic will be his biggest threat...he doesn't have that obvious weakness on a particular wing that Federer has (we know about the backhand...).

However, to suggest that Nadal might be vulnerable because of THAT Madrid DEFEAT...madness imo. Doubt he'd have lost in ordinary circumstances, and I think Rafa knows that as well (hasn't he even said it?). As long as Rafa is full of energy and not in physical discomfort come RG finals day, he should have it just as easy over Federer (assuming that is who he will play), whose major limitation can be more easily exposed on slower clay anyway.

But I wonder if Rafa might be vulnerable because of the KNEE...
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post #7 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 04:56 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

I still think Nadal is almost unbeatable at RG with his current form, but a favorable draw to Fed and Nole sounds a little chance for an upset to me.

Like Nadal having Verdasco, Monaco or anybody decent on clay at 4th round and quarters, then a semis and finals versus Nole and Fed consecutively.
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post #8 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:00 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Agree with the last bit...I don't see Djokovic, or anyone for that matter, beating a FIT Nadal over a 5-set clay court match. However, it is unfair to judge Djokovic entirely on the fact that he has yet to beat Nadal on clay...I mean, you could argue that Fed got lucky in both of his clay wins over Rafa. The Hamburg '07 was at the end of a 2-week stint for Rafa, and he'd survived a close shave against Hewitt in the Saturday SF. The Madrid 2009 final...well, nothing more needs to be said about that Saturday SF against Djokovic.

In essence, I agree with Reed thinking that Djokovic will be his biggest threat...he doesn't have that obvious weakness on a particular wing that Federer has (we know about the backhand...).

However, to suggest that Nadal might be vulnerable because of THAT Madrid DEFEAT...madness imo. Doubt he'd have lost in ordinary circumstances, and I think Rafa knows that as well (hasn't he even said it?).

But I wonder if Rafa might be vulnerable because of the KNEE...
I have to disagree with you on that. Nadal has crushed Novak's spirit now. Novak played out of his mind and still couldn't put the ball in play on a match point. That shows you he doesn't believe he can beat Rafa on clay. Roger has defeated Rafa on clay. At least he has that going. Novak can beat Roger. I give you that. But he has lost to Rafa on clay way too many times. I like someone to challenge Rafa but let's not forget Rafa has not lost in Paris forever. There is no threat to Rafa. Title is Rafa's to lose. But between Roger and Novak, I give the edge to Roger. Roger's ace is more potent and he actually has more variety and that new found drop shot. I think if Novak and Roger play as a team (2 on one), we may see a five setter.

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post #9 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:01 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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But I wonder if Rafa might be vulnerable because of the KNEE...
He said there was no pain on Sunday.

I'll be interested to see if he wears the knee straps in Paris.
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post #10 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:02 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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I still think Nadal is almost unbeatable at RG with his current form, but a favorable draw to Fed and Nole sounds a little chance for an upset to me.

Like Nadal having Verdasco, Monaco or anybody decent on clay at 4th round and quarters, then a semis and finals versus Nole and Fed consecutively.
Maybe Rafa playing Blake in the third round, Tsonga in the next, and maybe Davydenko and Novak and Roger. And if all the matches go to 5 sets, maybe just maybe.

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post #11 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:11 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Ridiculous from Reed to be even mentioning Nadal as a possible RG champ after what we saw at the weekend. Can't see past Fed for the title.

Yeah anyone who has won the RG title 4 years on the trot and has only lost one match on clay all season winning 3 titles on the surface shouldnt even be considered for RG.

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post #12 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:12 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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I have to disagree with you on that. Nadal has crushed Novak's spirit now. Novak played out of his mind and still couldn't put the ball in play on a match point. That shows you he doesn't believe he can beat Rafa on clay. Roger has defeated Rafa on clay. At least he has that going. Novak can beat Roger. I give you that. But he has lost to Rafa on clay way too many times. I like someone to challenge Rafa but let's not forget Rafa has not lost in Paris forever. There is no threat to Rafa. Title is Rafa's to lose. But between Roger and Novak, I give the edge to Roger. Roger's ace is more potent and he actually has more variety and that new found drop shot. I think if Novak and Roger play as a team (2 on one), we may see a five setter.
Depends which way you look at it. Obviously Djokovic will be very disheartened to have lost that match, and yes, it could have broken his spirit...equally, it is a good confidence booster, that he came so close. If he can get that close again, luck could work in his favour. Besides, I thought he had Nadal on the ropes in a couple of those match points? Should have finished him off on one of them (ball was long by a few inches?), and Nadal came up with a stunner on another? Couldn't have done much more if you ask me.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree. For me, Roger has had his chance to beat a fit Rafa in clay court matches...indeed, as far as I'm concerned, he has yet to beat a fit Rafa on clay, and never will. Would love to be wrong, but I just don't see it.

Djokovic COULD beat a fit Rafa over a 3-set match on clay imo...but probably not in the slowest conditions.

But, yeah, Rafa is still currently unbeatable over a 5-set clay match...doesn't matter who he faces.


Quote:
Originally Posted by l_mac
He said there was no pain on Sunday.

I'll be interested to see if he wears the knee straps in Paris.
Thanks for the clarification.

If I was reading correctly, and he had been taking cortisone shots for his knee earlier in the week (?), he will suffer the repercussions before too long (talking a few years probably).
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post #13 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:16 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Thanks for the clarification.

If I was reading correctly, and he had been taking cortisone shots for his knee earlier in the week (?), he will suffer the repercussions before too long (talking a few years probably).
Cortisone shots I only read that he'd taken an anti inflammatory for the thigh pain on Saturday morning. And that after it kicked in, along with massage and heat cream from the trainer during the match, it felt okay.

Where did you read that?
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post #14 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:16 PM
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Maybe Rafa playing Blake in the third round, Tsonga in the next, and maybe Davydenko and Novak and Roger. And if all the matches go to 5 sets, maybe just maybe.
I could see Djokovic being the only player CAPABLE of getting a set off Rafa out of that list.

Tsonga has yet to prove his worth on clay; Blake would be rudely exposed; Davydenko is probably a doubt even for participation in R1; Fed should improve on last year's embarrassment of a final, but I think he will still struggle to win a set.

Djokovic should have a good set and a half of tennis in him, but the question is whether the scoreboard will actually reward him for it. Otherwise, he too could fail to get a set.
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post #15 of 41 (permalink) Old 05-19-2009, 05:18 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Nadal May Be Vulnerable

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Depends which way you look at it. Obviously Djokovic will be very disheartened to have lost that match, and yes, it could have broken his spirit...equally, it is a good confidence booster, that he came so close. If he can get that close again, luck could work in his favour. Besides, I thought he had Nadal on the ropes in a couple of those match points? Should have finished him off on one of them (ball was long by a few inches?), and Nadal came up with a stunner on another? Couldn't have done much more if you ask me.

I think we'll have to agree to disagree. For me, Roger has had his chance to beat a fit Rafa in clay court matches...indeed, as far as I'm concerned, he has yet to beat a fit Rafa on clay, and never will. Would love to be wrong, but I just don't see it.

Djokovic COULD beat a fit Rafa over a 3-set match on clay imo...but probably not in the slowest conditions.

But, yeah, Rafa is still currently unbeatable over a 5-set clay match...doesn't matter who he faces.




Thanks for the clarification.

If I was reading correctly, and he had been taking cortisone shots for his knee earlier in the week (?), he will suffer the repercussions before too long (talking a few years probably).
You claim Roger has never beaten a fit Rafa. Tell me, has a fit Rafa ever lost? Not against you but I am tired of hearing this excuse. It's not like Rafa was forced to do a Marathon before the match. I would buy your argument if you mentioned the surface but not the fitness. Rafa is as fit as a bull and IMO he was still playing decent. You are telling me Rafa wouldn't have won had he made that backhand on that break point? I just don't see how you claim Novak can beat Rafa over 3 sets. How? He has never done it. Not on grass. Not on anything. Here is my thinking. Rafa will probably cruise with serving a bagel or two to all his opponents but if there is any threat, like a tiny teany threat (like being a break up in one set), that would be Roger. I can argue that Novak has never beaten a fit Roger without the help of the wind.

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