Henmans Best Surface... - MensTennisForums.com
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post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-09-2004, 11:57 PM Thread Starter
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Henmans Best Surface...

Hello guys this is my first post here since stumbling across it a few days ago - Great site guys btw! Anyway Im going to be a tad controversial... All the pundits say Henman's best surface is grass etc. but I wish to disagree there. Obviously Tim seems at home on both hard and carpet surfaces but I feel the clay court has to now be considered one of his best if not HIS BEST surface. What made me come to this conclusion is not simply Tim's heroics at France last week and his poor performance at Queens, but I have looked at his nemeses on grass during the past few years and simply do not think Tim has the capability of beating them on grass. Mainly being Lleyton Hewitt, Sebastien Grosjean, and Pete Sampras in his day. Also I look at other players on garss such as Roger Federer, Andy Roddick and cant see a Henman win. However, on clay I feel Tim would be the favourite to beat all of those guys and Id be confident in a Henman victory. In fact there are very few people who I feel Tim would not beat on clay. Its a big shame he couldnt hold it together against Coria as I feel he would most certainly have beaten Gaudio.
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post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:07 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Would you still come to this conclusion had Llodra won his match point against Henman?
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post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:11 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Probably not no but I feel the Llodra match was all part of a learning curve for Henman - he has proven against the likes of Chela, Blanco, and even Coria for a set and a half that he can cope with the traditional 'clay court' specialists on the surface but with the Llodra and Saulnier ones he came up against aggressive players who weren't afraid of coming into the net - but I feel Tim thankfully managed to counter it and Im sure he would win those matches at ease now.
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post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:13 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

hi paul

i have to say i was wondering that as well! off course its easy to think this after a sf at roland garros then a 1st round defeat at Queens, but all tim's great results on grass at wimbledon i have always felt is more to do with the support he gets, off course his game is serve and volley, so grass will suit his game, but if wimbledon and queens was indoor, he'd probably have the same results, who knows, maybe have won wimbledon a few times! i dont think he's a grass court specialist despite what every 1 in the world would say, he's just as good on grass as he is on hards/indoors, but i still think he's alot better on grass, lets remember he hasnt even been in a final on clay, let alone won a title........mind you, he hasnt won a title on grass either, but i see what your saying, id certainly feel more confident with tim playing roddick, federer or hewitt indoors than on grass, the problem for tim with grass is his serve, its not good enuff and guys always pick it off, especially Hewitt, which sadly we might see happen again this year if tim ever plays hewitt/federer/nalbandian or agassi.
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post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:24 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

There always seems to be a group of about 4 or 5 players who Tim finds it impossible to beat on grass whereas this is not the case on hard courts and clay courts. I agree with you that if Wimbledon and Queens were indoors he most probably would have won at least one or two titles especially with the crowd factor. I agree with you regarding Henman's serve as well - its nature on grass does leave him open to hard hitting returns - as you said Nalbandian and Hewitt being prime examples. His serve-volleying was extremely poor today but I have felt during the clay court season that it was the most successful part of his game - I felt more confident that his serve would not be picked off on clay than I do on grass.
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post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:43 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

i think the players he played on clay, well most of them are slow clay grinders who are used to playing theyre own kind, the clay actually gives henman more time to get to net and more time on volley'...it was so obvious in his grass matches with hewitt, nalbandian (at wimbledon) and today V beck, that he simply cannot get into the net fast enuff , he is having to hit far too many tough volley's/half volleys and these guys just come in and slam a winner past him, so many ppl on another thread saw his loss today v Beck just as an unimportant blip, but alot of them cant see that tim will play similar players to beck (federer,hewitt,nalbi) at wimbledon....and they will just kill henman as well

but you have to say, from the moment tim was a set and 4-2 up v coria in that RG match, his tennis has fallen to shreds, and his wimbledon chances look in utter tatters to me now.
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post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:48 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

and what makes matters worse is him not playing Nottingham, that to me is totally and utterly brainless...in 2 weeks of good grass tune ups and opportunity's he plays 1 match and loses...will go to wimby on the back of that loss.......will not have a competative grass season going when his 1st wimbledon match comes around (regardless of training, or supposedly exhibition matches), i mean he has totally screwed himself today quite frankly, is it any wonder he has never won wimbledon when you see things like this developing, its henman thru and thru.....creates a total disaster out of nothing.
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post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:53 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

clay is not the best surface of henman.

It may surprise you, but some clay courters are good draws, or better draws on clay for serve and volleyers than baseliners who prefer faster surfaces , many clay courters (not all) , like Chela or Galo Blanco are used to return serve 2 meters behind the baseline, giving the serve and volleyer a lot of time to reach the net.
Muster lost to rafter and stich in roland garros, and to edberg, everywhere, Zabaleta for example sucks against serve and volleyers on clay, he is mirnyi's bitch even on clay.

I would expect Henman to get trashed on clay by baseliners with good returns who are not clay court specialists like nalbandian, hewitt or schuettler.

I miss: Ivan Lendl, Korda, Novak, Bruguera, Rios, Kucera, Courier, Mantilla, Costa, Santoro and Ferreira.

Good luck to:

Gaudio, Murray, Florian Mayer, Chela, Nalbandian, Radek Stepanek, Volandri, Youzhny and Verdasco.

NICOLAS ALMAGRO IS AN EXOTIC BEAUTY
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post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:55 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

I agree with you Escude about the Beck match - I feel it WAS significant and did highlight that on grass Tim seems easy to pass these days. I know Karol Beck is obviously on a roll on the surface at the moment but still he is only challenger status and someone Tim should have easily defeated if he is looking to win Wimbledon. Its no coincidence that the guys who did well at Halle and Queens last year also did well at Wimbledon - and vice-versa ala Hewitt.
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post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 12:56 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

what I mean is, even if gaudio is better on clay than nalbandian, or schuettler, (gaudio is better on clay than nalbandian or rainer indeed), for henman gaudio is a better draw than nalbandian or rainer

I miss: Ivan Lendl, Korda, Novak, Bruguera, Rios, Kucera, Courier, Mantilla, Costa, Santoro and Ferreira.

Good luck to:

Gaudio, Murray, Florian Mayer, Chela, Nalbandian, Radek Stepanek, Volandri, Youzhny and Verdasco.

NICOLAS ALMAGRO IS AN EXOTIC BEAUTY
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 01:00 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Quote:
Originally Posted by TennisLurker
what I mean is, even if gaudio is better on clay than nalbandian, or schuettler, (gaudio is better on clay than nalbandian or rainer indeed), for henman gaudio is a better draw than nalbandian or rainer
its funny that tim beat gaudio 2 outta 2 on clay, but he's 0-3 on clay v zabaleta :cry:
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 01:00 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Yep I agree with you there - well I suppose it was proven with Rainer at Monte Carlo and in the matches against Llodra and Saulnier - bt I feel the latter two matches will have given Tim confidence in his ability to compete with the likes of Schuettler, Nalbandian etc. on clay. Tim will have worked out a gameplan by now Im sure.
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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 01:01 AM Thread Starter
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Escude
its funny that tim beat gaudio 2 outta 2 on clay, but he's 0-3 on clay v zabaleta :cry:
I was shocked with Tim's defeat at Rome to Zabaleta to be honest - before that he was looking at the top of his game on clay!
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 01:03 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

1-grass
2-carpet
3-hardcourt
4-clay

K.

Andy Roddick.Fernando Verdasco.Richard Gasquet.Tommy Haas





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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 06-10-2004, 01:05 AM
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Re: Henmans Best Surface...

Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulHopkins
I agree with you Escude about the Beck match - I feel it WAS significant and did highlight that on grass Tim seems easy to pass these days. I know Karol Beck is obviously on a roll on the surface at the moment but still he is only challenger status and someone Tim should have easily defeated if he is looking to win Wimbledon. Its no coincidence that the guys who did well at Halle and Queens last year also did well at Wimbledon - and vice-versa ala Hewitt.
you are right Paul, its a nightmare too see henman struggle badly v some1 like beck on grass, when a day earlier, every1 was touting henman to win wimbledon for sure, if tim played horribly and lost 2-6 2-6, then somehow that woulda almost been easy to accept, but the worrying thing is, he seemed to play very good, yet lost, and ok it was a close result 6-2 3-6 7-6, but you always felt beck was so much the better player all day, maybe the fact beck won 6 grass matches - and this was henmans 1st..well ok to make us henman fans feel better, we'll say that was 80% responsible for the defeat, but regardless, when tim was well into that 3rd set and had chances to win.it worrying all fell away, i mean really tim, should a possible wimbledon champ be struggling to hold serve as badly as that, (whereas beck was at 40-0 on his serve nearly all the bloody 1st and 3rd sets)
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