Federer and Nadal asked for a change in the Paris-Bercy surface - MensTennisForums.com

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post #1 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:06 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
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post #2 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:09 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
Indeed.

This is a disgrace to the sport. Even if it's my two fav players involved in this - I think it's an atrocity.

I'm rooting for Murray to win even more than I already did now.

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post #3 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:10 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Soon the ATP will invent a new general surface that pleases everyone and demand all tournaments to intall it.
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post #4 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:13 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

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Soon the ATP will invent a new general surface that pleases everyone and demand all tournaments to intall it.
don't give them ideas...

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post #5 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:32 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
I actually just got sick to my stomach reading this.

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post #6 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:38 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
i would say adapted to Federer and Nadal, the two who whinned, do u think atp would care about Montañes or Starace opinion?
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post #7 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:39 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
That's odd. Federer asking for a court to be slowed down?

Why are these organizers seceding control of their tournaments like that? This must be one of the few places where it's done. Hewitt has routinely complained that the Aussies pay no attention to his requests. Henman, well we know what they did with the grass and what that did for his results.

Until now I thought the USO was the only place where they have consciously made the courts the best they can for their own players, but now Paris joins in, and not for their home players. Too weird!
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post #8 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:39 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

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Originally Posted by Deboogle!. View Post
I actually just got sick to my stomach reading this.
Totally agree the system should overall be fair for everyone whether you're no1 or 100. There should be a selection of surfaces throughout the year but i'm struggling to think of a fast surface most HCs are now Med-fast. I think Nottingham grass was fast but that's all I could think of.
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post #9 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:40 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.

Source?
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post #10 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:41 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Carpet is obviously dying, but the cause of its death is sad, it is just not fitting for today's top players games. Never mind that styles go in waves, once it is dead it will be hard to resurrect. It is one thing to curtail it due to health hazards but I doubt there is a case that it is more dangerous than hardcourts. Another thing would be to die due to hardcourts having lower cost. I haven't seen the case for that either.

This is a case where the tournament organizer succumbed to bullying and the ATP stood by watching.

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post #11 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:47 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Source:
http://www.grandchelem.net/mon_weblo...ranois-ca.html

The relevant passage, in French, is

Vous êtes donc allé vers les joueurs en dépêchant Jean-François Bachelot pour connaître leur desiderata, est-ce que leur soucis principal c’était la surface ?
C’était en grande partie la surface. C’est sûr que pour deux d’entre eux, c’était une condition sine qua non de leur venue.

C’est qui les deux ?
Federer et Nadal. Le numéro 1 et numéro 2. Et pour des raisons tout à faire recevables. Nadal trouvait que la surface ne prenait pas ses effets donc son jeu n’avait plus aucune valeur. C’était vrai, la surface prenait moins les effets. Federer c’était un problème psychologique, il bloquait : « Je trouve moins bien mes appuis… »
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post #12 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 04:53 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Thanks. So I take it Jean Francois is the tournament director with Pioline or something?

This was not funny ....
Quote:

Oui d’ailleurs on lui a dit « Comme tu ne vas pas gagner Roland-Garros et que tu ne le gagneras jamais, il faut que t’aies un titre à Paris, viens jouer à Bercy… ». Non je plaisante.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
Source:
http://www.grandchelem.net/mon_weblo...ranois-ca.html

The relevant passage, in French, is

Vous êtes donc allé vers les joueurs en dépêchant Jean-François Bachelot pour connaître leur desiderata, est-ce que leur soucis principal c’était la surface ?
C’était en grande partie la surface. C’est sûr que pour deux d’entre eux, c’était une condition sine qua non de leur venue.

C’est qui les deux ?
Federer et Nadal. Le numéro 1 et numéro 2. Et pour des raisons tout à faire recevables. Nadal trouvait que la surface ne prenait pas ses effets donc son jeu n’avait plus aucune valeur. C’était vrai, la surface prenait moins les effets. Federer c’était un problème psychologique, il bloquait : « Je trouve moins bien mes appuis… »
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post #13 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 05:50 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by scoobsuk View Post
You don't have to look far.

Federer and Nadal made a change to the surface a condition of them playing.

Nadal said the surface "gave no value to his game" (read: topspin not that effective) and Federer said he had balance problems on the old surface.

I think it's outrageous that the top 2 players should combine in this way to effectively demand a surface be adjusted at a tournament, but there we are.

As I have said elsewhere, it used to be that the players had to adapt their game as best they could to the surface, but now it seems the surface is expected to be adapted to the players.
I'll be frank - I'm more irritated at the tournament directors than I am at Nadal and Federer. Players are CONSTANTLY complaining about surfaces. The problem is that Bercy conceded. Furthermore, it says something sad that the success of a tournament lays almost exclusively on the shoulders of Federer and Nadal. Players don't play at tournaments ALL THE TIME because of surface (Roddick and clay anyone?).
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post #14 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 06:02 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

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I'll be frank - I'm more irritated at the tournament directors than I am at Nadal and Federer. Players are CONSTANTLY complaining about surfaces. The problem is that Bercy conceded. Furthermore, it says something sad that the success of a tournament lays almost exclusively on the shoulders of Federer and Nadal. Players don't play at tournaments ALL THE TIME because of surface (Roddick and clay anyone?).
Paris is in a bit of a different spot, because they have a history of losing top players because of their position on the calendar. So that might explain why, maybe. Having said that, I think they might have guessed that No.1,2 would have shown up given the new bonus pool regardless of surface.

If it was an American tournament maybe they too would have succumbed to an American player's request for surface fiddling around. I don't think Roddick alone is enough to change slow clay into fast clay in Europe even if he asked for it. I don't think it would matter at all to be honest.
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post #15 of 228 (permalink) Old 10-29-2007, 06:14 PM
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Re: Fish fries Dima 7-6 6-4

Quote:
Originally Posted by cmurray View Post
I'll be frank - I'm more irritated at the tournament directors than I am at Nadal and Federer. Players are CONSTANTLY complaining about surfaces. The problem is that Bercy conceded. Furthermore, it says something sad that the success of a tournament lays almost exclusively on the shoulders of Federer and Nadal. Players don't play at tournaments ALL THE TIME because of surface (Roddick and clay anyone?).
Good point.
It's sad that Raf and Rogi feel the need to exert their power in this manner, but it is even more sad that tournament directors actually listen to them.

It shows how SICK the ATP (in its being of a board for TOURNAMENT DIRECTORS rather than for players) has become, thinking it's dependent on only two players for its succes.

Come on Muzza, take that title now.

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